KGNU’s Greg Schultz spoke with Noel McKay. McKay shared anecdotes about Guy Clark’s workshop, where they wrote and recorded songs together. McKay performed songs from his new album “You Only Live Always” and discussed his musical journey, including his time in Europe and his upcoming projects (Interview date: 7/30/2024)
Greg Schultz: Noel McKay is here, folks. He’s here to play some music, but I’m going to bring him in on this because Noel was a good friend of Guy Clark’s, wrote music with him, and spent time with him at his home in Nashville. Do you have any insights to share?
Noel McKay: Yeah, Guy had this high-dollar studio mic. The mic stand was always squeaky when he was moving around. The most recent recording device he used was a CD recorder, probably bought it in the late eighties. It’s just him singing into his mic and recording on whatever device he had in his workshop.
Greg Schultz: Wow. And you spent some time in that workshop and built a guitar with Guy Clark, correct?
Noel McKay: Yes, and we wrote some songs together. When we finished a song, he’d point the mic at me or sing into it. We recorded on that CD player. I’ve got some stuff in the Country Music Hall of Fame that’s in the Guy Clark exhibit. Not sure if anyone will ever listen to it, but it’s there.
Greg Schultz: If I get there, I’ll listen to it. That is a great story. I know you spent some time with him in his workshop. Can you give people a 30 second rundown of what that workshop was like?
Noel McKay: Smoky.
Greg Schultz: Okay. That’s about all we need to hear, right?
Noel McKay: Guy was pretty, I don’t know if obsessive is the right word, but he was keen to keep that place in orderly fashion. It was full of guitars in various states of progress and his workbench had that sort of famous skull ashtray.
It was always full of half smoked joints and cigarettes. It had a plywood floor. He had this workbench. I spent a lot of time working on this guitar that I’m playing today at that work bench. At a certain point, Guy had some trouble with his back and decided that he wanted that work bench raised up. So I took a skill saw and cut a bunch of six inch pieces of two by four, and we raised that work bench up so that it wouldn’t hurt his back when he’d work on guitars.
That was his shop. I miss it. I spent a lot of time there. And sometimes when Guy’s health was failing a little bit, he would have to go take a nap and I would work there by myself. Yeah, it was smoky when he was in there.
Greg Schultz: His tools were always aligned, it looked like, on the wall. Everything seemed to be meticulously in order. I remember reading that he liked these certain kinds of pencils. He was very keen on keeping everything looking really cool.
Noel McKay: And he wrote on graph paper.
Greg Schultz: That isn’t easy to write on.
Noel McKay: That’s what I’ll grab – a graph paper notebook just because. The other day I was digging around my mandolin. I have an old Collings mandolin that they gave me when they fired me. I found a piece of folded up graph paper that Guy had given me with some lyrics to a song that we wrote together as the first line in that mandolin case.
Greg Schultz: Wow, that’s like finding a gemstone, what a rare, beautiful treat. That’s fantastic. Those are great stories. And the only place you’re going to hear them is from guys like you. That’s for sure. We appreciate you sharing that.
If you want to get into a couple of tunes here and show the folks what you got and let us know what you want to play, then we’ll come back after a couple and talk some more.
Noel McKay: I’ll just play that song that I found the lyrics to. Wrote this with Guy Clark. Was a piece of homework, showed up and he had the lyrics written down on that graph paper and said, I can’t, I’m having a hard time. I’m banging my head against this. See what you can do with it. So I brought it back to him. He liked the first verse, he liked the chorus, but he didn’t like the second verse.
He said, I don’t know about that second verse, man. I took it home and brought him another one. Then he liked that verse. I wrote him a better second verse and we edited that a little bit until it was how we liked it. But then it must have exposed some weaknesses in the third verse, so he said, see what you can do with that. Took it home, same thing, brought it back and edited it together. Somewhere in that country music hall of fame exhibit is about five versions of this song. Guy would record me on one of his guitars that he’d built, and then he’d say, play this, play it on this one. I played about five different versions, it’s all on one CD I guess. The song’s called “Flying and Falling”.
Greg Schultz: Oh, wow. Beautiful tune. Love that one. I’ve heard it many times, of course, but not right in front of me. And that guitar, boy, so you built that and you take it around with you, huh?
Noel McKay: I don’t fly with it. I got a flight case for it. But I usually just take it with me when I don’t have to fly. I sometimes think about building one that looks just like it and can’t tell the difference. So I got all the materials for it. I got everything but the time.
Greg Schultz: It’s a beautiful guitar. What kind of a label did you put inside there? I’m just curious.
Noel McKay: I just copied Guy’s design. He would just write number whatever on there and prick his thumb. Guy had diabetes. I shouldn’t say that on the radio, but Guy would prick his thumb. and then he would have a bloody thumbprint and just put it on the label and so I did the same thing. I found some fancy paper and put my name on there. Gotta have one of those little mirrors that you work on the car with to stick in there. I guess luthiers use those too. Anyway, that’s my label. I just took some fancy paper and wrote myself a little label and put my thumbprint on there.
Greg Schultz: That’s a mighty fine looking guitar, that’s for sure. I am no luthier, but it sounds great. Sounds good coming over the earphones and I’m sure the folks are loving it.
Why don’t you give us one more tune and then we’ll get into the new record.
Noel McKay: I’ll do the title track. Alright. Wrote this in Santiago de Compostela, Spain.
Greg Schultz: All right, love that one. Title of that song is…
Noel McKay: “You Only Live Always”. That’s the title track to my new record.
Greg Schultz: That’s right. I thought I’d let you say that rather than me. You released that record at the end of April?
Noel McKay: Yeah. The release process is a fluid thing sometimes.
Greg Schultz: Yeah, exactly. It just keeps going, right?
Noel McKay: Until the next one.
Greg Schultz: Yeah, that’s what I mean. It’s the new record until there’s a new record.
Noel McKay: And I got another new record that’s not released yet that I recorded in France last year at a friend of mine’s studio close to Paris, and that’ll be out in the spring, I believe.
Greg Schultz: Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’ve listened to a lot of your records over the years and the stuff you’ve done with your brother way back in the 2000s. And then the stuff you do with Brian Lee and your own stuff. This is a bit of a departure, I think, for you. You encompass all kinds of different stuff into your music. You have a little jazz, you got folk, you got country, you have all that. I guess it’s in your blood, Lubbock, West Texas. We hear and read about, us non-Texans, how that resonates within your being. So this one kind of shifts a little bit. Is there something you could add to what I’m trying to say, even though maybe people haven’t heard a lot of the record? Am I in the right direction or not?
Noel McKay: Well, my mom passed away and it’s just me reckoning with mortality, I guess, this record. And it’s complicated, probably more complicated than it ought to be. Guy was always scolding me for writing too complicated. I’m feeling the need to simplify now. It’s a collection of different stuff and some of it is thematic. Some of it deviates from that, but I’m proud of it. I think it came out pretty good.
Greg Schultz: Oh, it’s fantastic. There’s always Noel McKay humor somewhere laid into your songs and into your records. I have to commend you for that. And you write about what you know. Sometimes you write about what you don’t know, but I find your humor. You may not have a smile on your face, but your songs have a smile on them. Now you got a smile. That’s the way I interpret, that’s the way I hear your stuff. It’s just my two cents worth, but yeah, I’m really enjoying the record and thank you so much for dropping one by here. You’re out on the road and you’re driving through Colorado and you got a show coming up.
Noel McKay: On Thursday. I’m playing in Montrose, at the Healthy Rhythm Art Gallery. Come on out to that if you’re in the area.
Greg Schultz: Yeah, we reach out, we have this internet thing and people over there listen to us. So hopefully if you’re living over there, anywhere near, get out and see Noel, you won’t be disappointed. That much I can guarantee. And if you ever come this way you can tell me face to face, just stop into the station and say, Hey, I saw Noel McKay. Thanks for the tip. That’s the kinda stuff I like about being around here. But we’re happy to have you and this new record. So did you write most of the songs in Europe?
Let me ask this question because I saw an interview with you years ago. You were talking about how the Europeans love folk music over there.
Noel McKay: Yeah. I love them back. It’s nice to have that. I think there’s something exotic there, about the way that I speak. I did grow up speaking some Spanish. And so that comes in handy when I’m in Spain. Tried to learn Norwegian for a little while. That was more difficult. But I tried, and I love Norway and the United Kingdom, Ireland and France. I feel very fortunate to have people that like my music and people that I really care about as human beings in Europe. I like to go there and spend time there.
Greg Schultz: Sounds like it’s going to be part of the plan and you’ve been spending a lot of time there. I know you’ve been traveling back and forth over there for years and years. I remember one time you mentioned something about how much you liked Ireland. That’s what made me gravitate to that question because every guy who has a guitar, a woman who has a guitar who goes to Europe, they just love it.
Noel McKay: Yeah, I’m grateful.
Greg Schultz: They’re grateful to have you guys. That’s for sure. Let’s play another tune.
Noel McKay: Can I play a new one?
Greg Schultz: Yes. You play whatever you want, man.
Is there any inspiration for that song or am I allowed to ask?
Noel McKay: There was a girl that I had a crush on that was into boxing. She was short and they couldn’t find anybody in her weight class. But she got in the ring anyway, just got knocked out. So that was the inspiration. She got a scar from the whole thing.
Greg Schultz: Pretty funny.
Noel McKay: I just made up the rest.
Greg Schultz: That’s what I meant. You write what you know, and then you make up the rest, right? That’s good. The chording almost reminds you of getting punched or something.
Noel McKay: Don’t want you to feel like you’re getting punched.
Greg Schultz: No, not me getting punched, just the song.
Noel McKay: The guitar’s part of the deal, I guess
Greg Schultz: Not me personally. Just kind of goes along with the tune, I guess is what I was trying to relay there. That’s a very cool song. And that’s gonna be on the new one?
Noel McKay: I don’t know. I just like it and so I wanted to play it. I still think about groups of songs in terms of records, but I guess in a way I’m trying to wrap my brain around the idea that’s not the end all be all concept about how to get real music out there.
So I might release that as a single or something. Who knows? Our way of consuming music, it’s based on the idea that when the LP came out, that was as much music as you could fit on an LP. I think it also worked in a way because that was the approximate attention span of our ears.
I think to hear the same sound about 45 minutes worth of music maximum, that’s all you could get out of an LP, probably more like 35. But now, I think you can cram a lot more music into a release, and yet, paradoxically, our attention spans are shorter than ever. So my songs are getting shorter.
As I’m writing, I’m finding that because my attention span is shorter, I’m feeling the need to imply a lot of things lyrically, cram as much information into a short space as I possibly can.
Greg Schultz: And you still had to flip the album over too, so you got a little break there back in the day when I was a kid. You stop, you turn it over, and then you got another 25 minutes or something.
Noel McKay: It’s an engaging experience.
Greg Schultz: It’s cathartic for me. To take the album and turn it over and go, oh, I get to start this thing again. Especially if it’s a really good album, right? Usually is if you’re playing it at home, at least you better like it.
Noel McKay: There’s no obligation to flip it over to side B if it’s not.
Greg Schultz: That’s a really good point. I’ve done that many a time. That’s for sure. I got lots of scratches and crackles and these old records of mine that prove it.
So what’s next? You’re here in the States, you spend time in Spain, like you said, and you want to get back to Austin and spend some more time there. Are you gonna do some band shows or anything? I saw you had some really good players, man. James Shelton and Rebecca Paddock.
Noel McKay: Yeah. I’ve got a gig at the Sagebrush. Same place. Some of the same band maybe. I don’t know. Do I have the same band?
Greg Schultz: I don’t know who your bass player was. You have so many great steel players in Austin, but James Shelton held the fort down really nice.
Noel McKay: James is great. I saw him a couple nights ago at Sam’s Town Point playing country jams. That’s the 5th of September. I’m playing at Sagebrush and I’ll have a band. Then the next band show that I have is in Madrid. Then I’ve got one in Barcelona. That’s a different band.
Greg Schultz: But you got a good group of guys, a rhythm section that hang with you over there?
Noel McKay: Yeah. My rhythm section is from the United Kingdom, but they live in Madrid these days.
Greg Schultz: Man, I gotta get there one of these days. I just have to get to Spain. I don’t know how many people have told me that. Countless. I’m glad that you’re finding your footing over there and you have been for quite some time, and now you’re able to hang your hat over there for more than just going and coming back too, which is really nice.Spend some quality time doing what you like to do amongst the people, like you said, that you love over there.
Noel McKay: Yeah, lots of people I love over there, and I’ve been remodeling an old farmhouse and just playing gigs here and there. People respond well. There is a language barrier, although everyone under the age of about, 65, 70 speaks some English. But I’m finding that if I can introduce my songs in Spanish, then their grasp of the language is good enough that they can follow along. And that helps a lot.
Greg Schultz: I think they appreciate that too. You’re living in their country. They’re engaging, you’re learning their language. I know you sung Spanish songs in the past.
Noel McKay: I did. And there’s several of them on my first record, Sketches of South Central Texas.
Greg Schultz: And a couple of them deal with your brother back in the day. I think I asked him when he was in here something about, do you speak Spanish? He goes, no, only my brother speaks Spanish. He sings it pretty well.
Noel McKay: You know why that is? When I was a really young kid, we lived in Corpus Christi, my parents and me, before my brother was born. It’s a very bilingual community. I went to a bilingual school as a toddler. And then we moved to Lubbock and there wasn’t anything like that. My brother was born in Lubbock. So it just wasn’t around him. He can sing great in Spanish, but he doesn’t speak it.
Greg Schultz: Yeah, he made mention of that. He’s proud of his older brother. Don’t let him fool you. It was great to have him in here too.
Noel McKay: Yeah, he’s great. He’s a great writer.
Greg Schultz: He is, and a hell of a bass player. Your brother can play the bass, man.
Noel McKay: He was a prodigy bass player. When he was 15 he was in the jazz band and it was just- his capacity to play the bass. Sometimes if I’m on a budget, I’ll play bass on a record, but I’m just copying him. I’m just trying to do my imitation of Hollin McKay. We’re talking about putting together a Tex Mex band in Austin.
Greg Schultz: He could definitely do that. That’s for sure. I’ll come out for that show. I guarantee I’ll be there. I’d love to see a little reunion. I know you guys have done some reunion shows, but typically with just acoustic guitars.
Noel McKay: That’s right.
Greg Schultz: So I’ll be there. I’ll road trip out. How’s that? Stop in your old hometown Lubbock and then I’ll pay my respects to all your brethren there. And then I’ll head on down to Austin.
Noel McKay: I drove through Lubbock yesterday. I drove by the old house and took a picture of my old mulberry tree that I sat in and listened to country music. My great grandmother gave me a Spirit of 76 Transistor radio, and I used to sit in that tree and listen to that, miss my grandparents that were 10 hours away, south of San Antonio and Pearsall. My dad always bought me a new nine volt battery when the other one was about to get scratched.
Greg Schultz: Did you put it on your tongue?
Noel McKay: Oh, once or twice. It’s not that fun. It’s a cheap thrill.
Greg Schultz: Doesn’t matter where you grew up, boys aren’t always the smartest group of people.
We’ll do one more tune, but before we get going, I remember reading your grandfather had started a radio station.
Noel McKay: KVWG in Pearsall, Texas. He played country music all day and there was Mexican music that played all night. It was a bilingual community and he wanted to serve both communities with the radio station.
Greg Schultz: That’s fantastic. I’m an old guy who likes radio. I grew up on it myself. So when I read that, I go, I gotta ask you about that. Glad I wrote that down.
Noel McKay: He was a uniter, my grandfather.
Greg Schultz: It’s been a pleasure having you. Folks, we’ve had Noel McKay in here playing some tunes, talking about his life, his songwriting, his songs, his family, and his friendship and love of Guy Clark, and we appreciate the beautiful insight you shared with us. Really special.
Noel McKay: Guy did a lot for me. Won’t ever forget it. I miss him every day. He was a great friend and a good champion of my music. It’s hard to lose somebody that believes in you like that.
Greg Schultz: He loves you guys, man. Before we go out where can we find all things Noel McKay on social media? How do you find you?
Noel McKay: I’m on Instagram, Noel McKay. And same thing with Facebook. My website, where you can buy my records, noelmckay.com. And I have an online store.
Greg Schultz: You Only Live Always, man. That’s the new one, folks. Definitely highly recommended, and we have it here at the station now, so we will be spinning that on numerous types of programs. Been a pleasure to have you in here and interview you. Talked to you a little bit more than I did last time I saw you. What are you gonna take us out with? Give us one more, Noel.
Noel McKay: I’ll play you a song that’s on the new record.
Greg Schultz: Awesome.
